Richardsons

[Broads01]

53 minutes ago, garryn said:

At Stalham according to the plan there are moorings for 196 hire boats or charter as they call them which is pretty much what they have now. This is the first year in quite a while that they haven't sold any off at the end of the season. The overall capacity to moor the boats will actually increase as the centre basin will be widened and lengthened.

Good point, and I agree the "storage" moorings may well be used for the hire fleet in the way they do currently.

[Captain]

I recently had a week at Brundall however as a boat nerd I spent 5 days touring what wasn't flooded including numerous trips to Richardsons new cafe. Most of my trips I saw no more than one/two people in the cafe which to be honest I wasn't expecting to be open with little or no passing trade. It was the first time I had been round the yard since hiring Swan Romance in 2019. What a change,  the reception, cafe and several out buildings have all been renewed or refurbished to a decent standard, lots of new tarmac and parking. They have completely rebranded with charter rather than hire. 

Having spent a fair chunk of change on all this new investment they are now going to dig it all up and start again which they are perfectly entitled to do and in many ways its good to see new investment. Particularly when yards like Nbd are mothballing investment plans due to increasing licence fees, cost of living, end of staycation. I guess Richardsons must have a very friendly bank manager, money left over from prior sales or a magic money tree although I believe their bookings are some of the best on the Broads relatively speaking. 

Looking at plans I am glad to see Acle seeing some much needed investment, I am slightly more sceptical about Stalham although I guess the proof is in the pudding. The main boat shed and ancillary sheds are close to the boats, the new main shed is some way from the shed so the staff will have to be very fit or a truck will be needed to carry Linen etc. The lodges appear to be next to the road industrial area opposite with a large car park not exactly scenic Waterside, although the location of the old main shed is now going to be  mainly greenery. 

Not sure what the difference is between Charter and Charter storage unless storage is for all the boats they are selling? Either way the fleet is set to drop from 214 currently to either 190 or 130, hopefully the former. Also interested to see the public moorings on the main river. I didn't realise Rickos owned the land opposite Broads Edge.

As has been suggested I imagine planning was pushed through with the help of the visitor centres, education facilities and I maybe cynical however Greg Munford was very understanding of the increase in BA boat fees a while back (23 year). I Guess he wouldn't want to rock the boat so to speak. 

I don't want to be negative about new investment I just hope this all works out.

Neil 

 

 

 

 

[MargeandParge]

They couldn't have done it without the profits from the cafe outside my value for money list.

Kindest Regards Marge and Parge 

[MargeandParge]

Is the wet shed staying ?

Kindest Regards Marge and Parge 

[garryn]

27 minutes ago, MargeandParge said:

Is the wet shed staying ?

Kindest Regards Marge and Parge 

Yes thats about the only thing that's not been touched.

[BroadAmbition]

I hope it will be touched. Certainly is overdue a facelift / maintenance 

Griff

[garryn]

There were rumours  of a new wet shed near the John Williams basin but thats about the only rumour that didn't materialise.

[Vaughan]

17 hours ago, grendel said:

48 new private moorings, 12 day boat moorings and 12 visitor moorings in the old basin, well I suppose if they are selling off half their fleet it makes sense to provide new private moorings for the new owners.

As you say, these new moorings will probably be filled by second-hand hire boats.  At Richardsons I have counted 242 private mooring spaces on the new plan, including those in the wet shed today.  I don't know how many private moorings they have there already but let's say there will be an increase of 100 boats.  Where will they come from?

It's hard to get exact figures but I think I am safe in saying that a large hire boat ( say over 38ft) pays £1200 more in river toll than a private boat.  So, including the 50 new moorings at Acle, my "ball park" figure would be a loss of well over £100,000 a year in river tolls to the BA.

That is, of course, if they don't lay up the spare hire fleet on shore while they are being sold and don't pay any toll at all.  It would not be the first time - or even the second - that a large chunk of Richardsons' fleet have ended up in the nettles behind the engineer's shop.  In that case, 100 boats laid up would be a potential loss to the BA of over £200,000 a year.

And where are all these new moorings going to get service?  Diesel for instance, or toilet pumpouts?  I don't see any planned facilities at either Stalham or Acle.  And where can they be hauled out, for winter maintenance?  On the Acle moorings I don't think there are even enough spaces for all the boat owners to park their cars.

Excuse me but I now begin to understand why the CEO, as a member of the BA nav committee, has not appeared to be making a lot of noise about toll increases.  Probably keeping his head down!

[MargeandParge]

They might sell some off as HW did and end up with a free business.

Kindest Regards Marge and Parge 

[grendel]

2 hours ago, Vaughan said:

And where are all these new moorings going to get service?  Diesel for instance, or toilet pumpouts?  I don't see any planned facilities at either Stalham or Acle.  And where can they be hauled out, for winter maintenance?  On the Acle moorings I don't think there are even enough spaces for all the boat owners to park their cars.

I did see there is a smallish wet shed/workshop planned at Acle, as well as a note on the visitor moorings diesel and pumpout, plus a sign for a diesel tank. but suppose those 12 day boats were all electric?

[MargeandParge]

A cynic might think that they could franchise the visitors centres to (now let me think) and they could then make a charge for any visitors moorings in the vicinity either side of the river to cover staffing costs .

Kindest Regards Marge and Parge 

[Bluebell]

41 minutes ago, MargeandParge said:

A cynic might think that they could franchise the visitors centres to (now let me think) and they could then make a charge for any visitors moorings in the vicinity either side of the river to cover staffing costs .

Kindest Regards Marge and Parge 

That would never work surely…🤔

[BuffaloBill]

23 hours ago, MargeandParge said:

A cynic might think that they could franchise the visitors centres to (now let me think) and they could then make a charge for any visitors moorings in the vicinity either side of the river to cover staffing costs .

That's a good way of keeping people away from the sites.....

[grendel]

28 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

That's a good way of keeping people away from the sites.....

would they not require a planning application for change of use- the current application clearly states free 24 hour moorings (at the acle site), so it would be a change of use to start charging for them if the current application was accepted.

[marshman]

I know my views frequently are different to those of others but what is it that people expect free moorings?

I pay my taxes and my local taxes through my rates, which pay for my car parks, but I do not whinge constantly about paying to park my car? (Well I do!!) I just accept it as part of life. If I go to many places, not only do I pay to go in, often you pay to park as well. When I fly from Stansted, the airport provide me with a car park and I seemingly willingly pay to park - yet the airline I am flying with also pay to use the airport to provide facilities for their passengers. If I want to go to a beach, and not necessarily stop in a grass field owned by the council, I still have to pay the owner of the land to park. 

Except where leased, the BA do not own river banks but even if someone puts in and supplies facilities, why should they not charge?

 

[bucket]

Don't you think that if they had intended to charge for mooring they would not have included "free" in the application in the first place?

Personally, I welcome the ambition shown in the planning submissions for Acle Bridge and Stalham. In difficult times, Richardsons are looking to make the most from their assets. Boats, land, locations and I am sure, their people as well......good luck to them!

Cheesey69 started a thread last year, exploring the difference between charter and hire for boats on the Broads. I concluded (rightly or wrongly) that there wasn't much difference except the price! As has been mentioned, there is a large area in the Stalham marina proposals, designated to charter

Time will tell but I don't expect to see a huge reduction in the Richardsons fleet. I am sure they will turn round some of the older fleet but will continue to buy or build more of the top end (charter?) boats.

And, speaking of ambition, let's not forget Clive Richadson's proposals for Horning Pleasurecraft, coupled with his growing of his excellent hire fleet through building and buying. 

It is good to see confidence in the future, I hope that the new year, as it unfolds, brings a bit more confidence for all of us, goodness knows we need some!

 

 

 

 

[RumPunch]

At a slight tangent, one aspect of the proposal is the educational aspect. There are already very local organisations offering similar - I hope they can both co-exist

[LizG]

41 minutes ago, RumPunch said:

At a slight tangent, one aspect of the proposal is the educational aspect. There are already very local organisations offering similar - I hope they can both co-exist

If they are looking to get additional funding such as a grant - they need to tick extra boxes and adding education and public participation will help/is essential!

[bucket]

4 minutes ago, LizG said:

If they are looking to get additional funding such as a grant - they need to tick extra boxes and adding education and public participation will help/is essential!

This is absolutely correct LizG!.....education, conservation, equality/diversity, community engagement and "carbon neutral" are all hoops to jump through if you want to succeed with external funding bids, government funding (core or otherwise), and for major commercial development planning applications as well.

I have sometimes wondered if this might be the reason behind some of the seemingly odd (to me anyway) BA priorities?.........apols for thread drift.

[Broads01]

Continued "pensioning off" of the older fleet boats is inevitable given the number they have being 30+, 40+ and even 50+ years old. However, I do hope they retain at least a small core of the older boats as the market for them is still very much there. Some years ago they went through a phase of gutting out older boats and fitting a brand new interior which I thought worked really well (e.g. Concerto, Calypso, Capri) and I'd love them to do that again.

[MauriceMynah]

Well, I've read this thread and to be honest have been very surprised by many of the comments on it.

Richardson's aren't new boys on the block and I can't help thinking they may well have some vague idea of what they are about.

They are investing in the Broads. That alone should make us happy, keeping the Broads as a holiday destination is essential. 

[oldgregg]

50 minutes ago, Broads01 said:

Continued "pensioning off" of the older fleet boats is inevitable given the number they have being 30+, 40+ and even 50+ years old. However, I do hope they retain at least a small core of the older boats as the market for them is still very much there. Some years ago they went through a phase of gutting out older boats and fitting a brand new interior which I thought worked really well (e.g. Concerto, Calypso, Capri) and I'd love them to do that again.

I think there's a desire to get rid of the 'colourful' stuff which is why you see a lot of the older bathtubs with vinyl wraps on them and I think over the next decade we'll see the fleet shifting towards being primarily boats in white gel. 

But generally, yeah I agree. The public only has such a desire to have new boats because in many fleets the older ones aren't looked after.

It's something the industry has done to itself really and Richardson's proved back in the early noughties that a half-decent refit is pretty cost effective.

New boats are lovely and shiny but they're also very expensive and when times are harder it is much more difficult to fund the purchase. If you have a fleet of 'middle-aged' boats that are kept in great condition then costs are lower.

Earning potential is lower if everyone has the new and shiny stuff, but if they don't then it's all relative. 50 years is too old for a hire boat really, but 20-30 isn't.

[Mouldy]

5 minutes ago, Broads01 said:

Continued "pensioning off" of the older fleet boats is inevitable given the number they have being 30+, 40+ and even 50+ years old. However, I do hope they retain at least a small core of the older boats as the market for them is still very much there. Some years ago they went through a phase of gutting out older boats and fitting a brand new interior which I thought worked really well (e.g. Concerto, Calypso, Capri) and I'd love them to do that again.

Maybe the increase in costs of labour and materials would make that economically not viable now.  Several of the more recent additions to Richardson’s fleet have been pre-owned craft that have been purchased at reduced price when compared to new.

As you rightly mentioned, many of their older fleet are over 40 years old.  Rather than spending many thousands of pounds on new engines and internal refits and still only hire them out as budget boats at relatively cheap prices, I think it would be better financial sense to sell them on and invest in newer craft that will hire out for a greater return.  That way, they reduce the fleet size, reduce the overheads to keep them as hire boats by reducing the outlay on tolls, turnaround cleaning and maintenance and annual off season maintenance costs too.

[Bikertov]

All very well, but to pension off and sell on the older hire fleet, there had to be a matching market to buy them.

Is there still such a big market for 40+ year old ex-hire boats ?

[Mouldy]

5 minutes ago, Bikertov said:

All very well, but to pension off and sell on the older hire fleet, there had to be a matching market to buy them.

Is there still such a big market for 40+ year old ex-hire boats ?

If they’re sensibly priced, probably there is.  A good many of the old ‘bathtubs’ have found new homes.  Some of the larger craft appear to be more difficult to shift though, such as the old Ideal 45’s, but that may be down to a more limited market for private craft that size, due to tolls and repair costs.