Sunrise From Richardson's Was Stuck Under Wroxham Bridge This Afternoon

[Oddfellow]

11 hours ago, Warp said:

Was this the pilot?!

I have no idea if this was the pilot or the hirer. 

We tell hirers that we will not cover them for any damage caused by negligence or wilful misuse. We make a point of showing people a bridge height marker in the flesh as there's one 100 yards from us and emphasise the height of the boat and where to find that info. 

We also tell people that the waiver does not cover them for any damage to the roof as "you should have seen it coming".......

Basically, please don't take risks with other people's property. 

3 hours ago, JawsOrca said:

  (but how many newbies are there really these days) 

Lots and lots of newbies. I would suggest that 20% of our customers are newbies. I can recall at least two that I have shown out in the last 10 days; one was a single handed helmsman and the other two ladies. We spend a lot of time with people on the river to ensure that they have a degree of competence and understanding as to how the boat moves and manoeuvres. 

 

[SwanR]

I realise that this topic didn't start out as being about the damage waiver but as it's been mentioned ...

... what does irk me slightly about it is that it's the same amount with at least some boatyards no matter how long you hire for. I checked one site out to be sure and found that it was £45 for a weekend and still £45 for four weeks! That doesn't really reflect the fact that there is more chance of the boat sustaining some damage, even if only minor, the longer you have it on hire.

And as such it puts a weekend or midweek break up in price by a disproportionate amount of money. It's not that I mind paying it but I wish it was charged on a sliding scale dependent on how many nights the hire is for.

[Warp]

The thing that irks me about damage waivers is that they lead directly to some hirers not giving a monkeys about hitting others. It literally says you have no financial responsibility to take care of others property including the hire yard's! So if you are ever left dumbfounded by someone who fails to grasp why you should get so het up about them hitting you this is why. In their context it's a zero financial impact which being human they simply assume is the same for you. 

[Liberty]

Warp, if only I could hit the 'like' button more than once!!

Hit for the second time this season at the weekend.  Grrr...

[JennyMorgan]

I honestly can't remember when I was last hit by a hire boat down South. What's it about up North? I've been hit twice up North in the last four years, albeit damage I easily repaired. One a dayboat on Hickling, the other a small private boat at Martham. 

[Liberty]

Dodgems up here at the moment.  

 

[Hockham Admiral]

16 hours ago, Liberty said:

Dodgems up here at the moment.  

 

Not tool sure where you are but on the Bure and today the Ant it's been serene!

[vanessan]

The Waveney is very quiet too, particularly upstream of Beccles bridge!

[unclemike]

22 hours ago, deebee29 said:

They still do and it's in the handbook 

having just left richo's office i can categorically say there is a large notice saying"under no circumstances must boats be taken under wroxham bridge without a pilot, the £12 will be refunded"

[deebee29]

The refund bit is new since last September.

with Richardsons, we have always had to sign the pilot's sheet and the £12.00 had to be paid ( or deducted from any fuel deposit remaining) upon returning the boat.

[Liberty]

4 hours ago, Hockham Admiral said:

Not tool sure where you are but on the Bure and today the Ant it's been serene!

Hit at Ranworth, hit at St Benets.  Poor chap at Ranworth got it wrong, got stressed and resorted to throttle, hitting everything in sight multiple times on Friday evening.

[JanetAnne]

A newbie recently had a nibble with Wroxham bridge, got himself out of trouble, moored upstream and then called the yard for advice. The engineer arrives and, after checking all was OK and damage minimal, pointed out to the hirer that  the pilot was to be used at Wroxham etc etc. "Oh," says the newbie "is this Wroxham"?...

 

[BroadScot]

4 minutes ago, JanetAnne said:

Oh," says the newbie "is this Wroxham"?...

Young Alan......shaking head smillie required I think !  I do wonder if geography is taught today in schools ! 

[Jonathan]

34 minutes ago, JanetAnne said:

A newbie recently had a nibble with Wroxham bridge, got himself out of trouble, moored upstream and then called the yard for advice. The engineer arrives and, after checking all was OK and damage minimal, pointed out to the hirer that  the pilot was to be used at Wroxham etc etc. "Oh," says the newbie "is this Wroxham"?...

 

Of course, the answer could be:  "No, it's Hoveton (but that is Wroxham bridge)!"

[LondonRascal]

I can appreciate someone who has never been on the Broads being unclear to where they are.

Generally speaking these days very few people have any dealings with any paper based mapping – those who used to, have long switch over to satellite navigation in their car – it is after all far easier.  There are also a growing number of younger people who would not bother with a dedicated sat nav anyway, when their phone can do a good job with Google Maps and it’s built in spoken instructions.

So for someone never having been on the Broads before – and unsure really what this part of the country is referred to (for many I have personally spoken to over time in London do not know where Norfolk is and needs some explaining usually with the help of said Google Maps) get on board their boat are have a large paper map to plot their travels on and think ‘what the flip’.

You might figure out you are in Stalham and you wish to go to somewhere called Wroxham – but at no point in all the journey would you find any signs to give an indication you are on the right path – even at the mouth of the Ant, it does not make it clear having turned right you are now on the Bure headed for Horning and Wroxham to give some peace of mind. 

Passing through Horning as you continue your cruise, easy for us to know – but you would not know it unless you figured that the places being passed - such as the pubs - were shown on the map in somewhere called Horning.

Above all though what has annoyed me the most about the Broads is the lack of clarity with signage. It really hits home when you go on a long cruise as I did between Wrotham and Oulton Broad seeing the array of different types, sizes, placements, colours and typefaces – some with way too much actual wording on. 

There simply is no standard signage on the system (other than speed limit signs and waterskiing signs that I can see anyway) on the Broads. 

Further, there is no uniform typeface or size for the information signs or warning signs you might come across.  I have said this in great detail previously (indeed wrote the Broads Authority about this issue) that since we as a society are now so used to a caution sign being a black bordered yellow triangle with a black explanation mark on it, we automatically react to this compared to say a white sign with ‘caution’ written out using a red typeface followed by several lines of text.

I think many lessons from how our road signage developed to our Health & Safety signage has been produced could be learnt on the Broads – every bridge to have its name clearly shown, a standard warning sign for ‘low bridge’ and a caution sign with a clear simple instruction ‘check your boat height’ – for example to alert people this does actually need a bit of care. 

While many members here will sigh, roll eyes and think ‘what has the world come to’, I think it has indeed in many areas come to this. People need to be reminded in clear terms in an easy to understand way and a style they are used to think and take care – even if most might ignore the risks, some might head them more than do currently.

[Bound2Please]

28 minutes ago, LondonRascal said:

I can appreciate someone who has never been on the Broads being unclear to where they are.

Generally speaking these days very few people have any dealings with any paper based mapping – those who used to, have long switch over to satellite navigation in their car – it is after all far easier.  There are also a growing number of younger people who would not bother with a dedicated sat nav anyway, when their phone can do a good job with Google Maps and it’s built in spoken instructions.

So for someone never having been on the Broads before – and unsure really what this part of the country is referred to (for many I have personally spoken to over time in London do not know where Norfolk is and needs some explaining usually with the help of said Google Maps) get on board their boat are have a large paper map to plot their travels on and think ‘what the flip’.

You might figure out you are in Stalham and you wish to go to somewhere called Wroxham – but at no point in all the journey would you find any signs to give an indication you are on the right path – even at the mouth of the Ant, it does not make it clear having turned right you are now on the Bure headed for Horning and Wroxham to give some peace of mind. 

Passing through Horning as you continue your cruise, easy for us to know – but you would not know it unless you figured that the places being passed - such as the pubs - were shown on the map in somewhere called Horning.

Above all though what has annoyed me the most about the Broads is the lack of clarity with signage. It really hits home when you go on a long cruise as I did between Wrotham and Oulton Broad seeing the array of different types, sizes, placements, colours and typefaces – some with way too much actual wording on. 

There simply is no standard signage on the system (other than speed limit signs and waterskiing signs that I can see anyway) on the Broads. 

Further, there is no uniform typeface or size for the information signs or warning signs you might come across.  I have said this in great detail previously (indeed wrote the Broads Authority about this issue) that since we as a society are now so used to a caution sign being a black bordered yellow triangle with a black explanation mark on it, we automatically react to this compared to say a white sign with ‘caution’ written out using a red typeface followed by several lines of text.

I think many lessons from how our road signage developed to our Health & Safety signage has been produced could be learnt on the Broads – every bridge to have its name clearly shown, a standard warning sign for ‘low bridge’ and a caution sign with a clear simple instruction ‘check your boat height’ – for example to alert people this does actually need a bit of care. 

While many members here will sigh, roll eyes and think ‘what has the world come to’, I think it has indeed in many areas come to this. People need to be reminded in clear terms in an easy to understand way and a style they are used to think and take care – even if most might ignore the risks, some might head them more than do currently.

Idiot proof the Broads.... you might have some thing there Robin young man

[JanetAnne]

There is no "Welcome to Wroxham" sign on the river by the way, however, I am lead to believe it is well signposted by road 

We all know our way about through experience but map reading is no longer taught in schools and the slow travel times afloat can easily be a factor as well.

[johnb]

58 minutes ago, Bound2Please said:

Idiot proof the Broads.... you might have some thing there Robin young man

Where will I go to be an idiot then?

[Baitrunner]

I am struggling to work out how you get lost on the Broads? It's not like it's an Amazonian Rain Forest?

And all of the public moorings I have ever passed have their name on a sign so if you have a basic map (which all hire boats have) or a smartphone (which EVERYONE has) surely you can work out your close to xyz bridge?

Having said all that, I think the bright yellow "check your boat height sign" might be a good idea.

It all comes back to not really being interested in where you are going or what you are going to do and (mainly ignorant hirers, not ones on forums) just want to have a laugh and a good time, but don't realise there is a bit of effort needed to keep things safe and ship shape.

We have just come back from a weekend in Spain and between 4 of us we had sat navs, smartphones, maps, printed directions and had all checked out the route beforehand - and we only went 1.5 hrs down the motorway from the airport!! Why, because we all gave a Sxxt and wanted to get to our destination quickly and safely. And with the wife nominated to drive a left hooker, safety was our main concern..

To be honest I wish we could ban some of these idiots or make taking a boat out much more difficult and require proper tests, but I appreciate it would decimate the hire industry so guess we just have to put up with it and carry on discussing bridge hits, groundings, mooring faux pars, hit and runs, speeding boats, ogling boaters, boats and their wash and so on - but at least it does give us something to write about when we cant get out on our boats (and I am one of those writers!)

[JanetAnne]

13 minutes ago, Baitrunner said:

or a smartphone (which EVERYONE has) 

Erm......

[kfurbank]

16 minutes ago, Baitrunner said:

or a smartphone (which EVERYONE has) 

Problem is, a lot of people with smartphones, are not that smart?

[stumpy]

I think the best example of being geographically challenged I've seen was early this April. We were chugging back up to Stalham at about half five when a Richo's  bathtub came out of the Sutton split and hollered out "Is this the way to Yarmouth mate?" We just had time for a thumbs up before he zigzagged off into the evening. Sunset was about half six. We did wonder if they made it.

[JennyMorgan]

13 minutes ago, stumpy said:

I think the best example of being geographically challenged I've seen was early this April. We were chugging back up to Stalham at about half five when a Richo's  bathtub came out of the Sutton split and hollered out "Is this the way to Yarmouth mate?" We just had time for a thumbs up before he zigzagged off into the evening. Sunset was about half six. We did wonder if they made it.

What hope would they have if they decided to cross Breydon?

[Matt]

Ludham is a great example of people not knowing where they are. Seen many round the bend before the bridge glaze over with a look of horror with the windscreens and canopy up etc

[RobRiley]

It scares me sometimes when you consider the value of what you have hired, if I hire a car it is normally a £200 deposit, I once hired a Ferrari for a friends wedding, that deposit was closer to £2000