Stag & Hen Debate, Again!

[JennyMorgan]

 

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/environment/broads-stag-party-debate-boat-firms-argue-for-and-against-1-5101892

I know how I would vote!

http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/environment/groom-is-stripped-naked-and-urinated-on-during-stag-party-on-norfolk-broads-1-5100336

I just hope Plod becomes throws the book at them.

[Guest]

Throw the book! Waste of time reporting it! Toothless

[SwanR]

I think that as with many things in life, the bad behaviour of the few tarnishes the image of those who are perfectly well behaved. And where do you draw the line?

We saw a group of three boats out last June with a mixed party of young folk aboard. Our guess was that they were students who had just finished exams. There was a fair bit of noise and humour between the boats but they seemed to find places to moor that were away from other boats such as wild moorings on the Bure and the Ant where they tied the boats together and caused no-one any problems.

These kind of groups can feel intimidating and if you have young children on board then you don't want to be near any kind of foul language, excessive drinking or bad behaviour. But you might get that from any kind of larger party, not just stag dos and hen dos.

So what are you going to do ... ban all single sex parties, ban all parties with no-one over the age of 25, only allow couples or small families with children. I don't see an answer to this other than reporting any behaviour that is bad enough to be putting oneself or other people in danger. I would think that the boatyards take their reputation quite seriously and cannot afford to have damaged boats coming back in at the end of a hire.

[JennyMorgan]

Jean, the hire companies and agencies have long had the ability to filter out those that are likely to misbehave. Some yards take advantage of that filtering, others just grab any booking that comes their way. Personally I see the yards that encourage hen and stag parties as very short sighted. My feeling is that the industry looses far more potential bookings than it ever gains by encouraging hen & stag parties. Just my opinion!

[CambridgeCabby]

Anti social groups sadly come in all ages and sexes , the only way to effectively "police" bad behaviour is to report it to the authorities AND the hire yards and IF the yards and authorities are seen to act quickly and forcefully then hopefully it will be curtailed.

yes all male ,and female groups are often the offenders and if a simple extra contract about behaviour liable to end the hiring with no return of monies is issued then perhaps they may be more likely to behave.

the Broads are all about enjoying yourselves but not at the expense of others enjoyment .

 

we all have smart phones (Well almost all) and if the offending boats are videoed then they can have no defence when yard is emailed the video and they lose their holiday and money 

[JamesLV]

I think it's probably like any of these things, there is a minority that gives all associated a bad name, besides if you ban them from the broads they just become someone else's problem, I've met a few stag do's on my trips and never seen any bother whatsoever, in fact one group who we'd been playing darts and pool with in the pub in Ludham even cooked us breakfast the next day.

[Bound2Please]

Well here I go jumping to the defence of Hen and Stag parties not all of them cause problems, in fact the minority that do is minute.  Only a few weeks back we pulled into Gates Staithe to top up the water tank., moored there across the end of it was a boat with 7 or 8 lads all in drag no noise enjoying themselves. When they saw we wanted to get to the hose they moved the boat and even filled us up.

As we was about to leave after having a drink with them, a couple in there 40's/50's came over and said can we give your boat name to broads beat as we find their dress code totally unacceptable, I said no, I then told the lads if they get pulled over here is my phone number and get broads beat to ring me. I never got a call so I guess broads beat took it as a laugh as did we. 

I have come across far more couples and families that are disruptive to the peace on the broads, how many people complain about them, thats right very few, so why does so many complain about a minority of a minority type of visitor?

Charlie

[Gracie]

There's good and bad in all walks of life, in every town and city and most holiday destinations, you've only got to watch some of those holiday programmes on Sky to see what goes on abroad at places like Ibiza and the like. The Broads are tame in comparison, like Charlie, we've met a few Stags and Hens who've been great fun and well behaved, the worst behaviour I have seen is from the odd family or couple, even then it's few and far between

To report a bunch of lads because the dress code is unacceptable (just because they were in fancy dress) is laughable in my opinion

We were on my hen party and told by a lady on a passing boat that we should be in Ibiza because we were in bikinis and shorts etc  A beautiful summers day, a glass of wine and wearing a ruddy trench coat, I really don't think so

Grace

 

[JennyMorgan]

Trench coats, Gracie, now you're talking! 

[Boatingman]

Wise words Grace and Jean

I been boating on the Broads for fifty years average three weeks a year and have never encountered problems from all male/female parties perhaps I have been lucky.

The only problems I have encountered was from a couple who spent most of the night in violent argument then speed off at full speed at first light and being bussed by a very large private boat on Breydon resulting in. Being called as witness for the prosecution in a court case that followed 

Ray

[SwanR]

3 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

Jean, the hire companies and agencies have long had the ability to filter out those that are likely to misbehave. Some yards take advantage of that filtering, others just grab any booking that comes their way. Personally I see the yards that encourage hen and stag parties as very short sighted. My feeling is that the industry looses far more potential bookings than it ever gains by encouraging hen & stag parties. Just my opinion!

I understand that viewpoint equally well. I admit that when I have seen hire companies deliberately advertising that they welcome stag and hen dos, as a marketing tool, I have on occasion wondered about the wisdom of openly inviting these groups - that may affect my choice of boatyard. The perception is that these groups, more than anyone else, will be out to have a riotous time without consideration of other folk.

Not always true by any means and how many of us have heard a boat approaching before we can see it and hoped that they don't take the mooring next to us. I don't suppose that they are always stag and hen dos.

But openly inviting them as opposed to accepting any bookings that might come their way are two very different things.

[JennyMorgan]

Just now, SwanR said:

I understand that viewpoint equally well. I admit that when I have seen hire companies deliberately advertising that they welcome stag and hen dos, as a marketing tool, I have on occasion wondered about the wisdom of openly inviting these groups - that may affect my choice of boatyard. The perception is that these groups, more than anyone else, will be out to have a riotous time without consideration of other folk.

Not always true by any means and how many of us have heard a boat approaching before we can see it and hoped that they don't take the mooring next to us. I don't suppose that they are always stag and hen dos.

But openly inviting them as opposed to accepting any bookings that might come their way are two very different things.

Jean, a very fair comment, I agree.

[MauriceMynah]

Some behaviour can go way above that which can be thought of as "acceptable", and the press releases linked to at the start of this thread show a case in point. HOWEVER, that behaviour was illegal and should have been reported to the police as such. Video evidence may help, but be careful if you are the one taking it.

If the behaviour is illegal, report it. If it isn't then put up with it or move on... BUT don't start whinging about banning this group or that group, that is the way of a totalitarian regime.  

 

4 hours ago, Alone1 said:

Throw the book! Waste of time reporting it! Toothless

I think Wildfuzz might disagree with you on that one... I certainly do.

[Wyndham]

8 minutes ago, SwanR said:

... how many of us have heard a boat approaching before we can see it and hoped that they don't take the mooring next to us.

I think that is part of the problem. (If there is a problem) Because of the nature of the broads, the peacefulness, the tranquillity, the wildlife, the beauty, we (don't ask me to define "we") expect it to be like that all the time, it's why so many enjoy going out of season, when the crowds are not there, but it is somewhere to be enjoyed by everyone, even if their idea of enjoyment isn't in line with others.

I have never, in my relatively short time on the broads, had a problem with anyone and I actually enjoy seeing groups having fun.

Of course having said that, antisocial behaviour is wrong wherever it happens and should be dealt with.

[LizG]

I remember cleaning a boat in 1979/1980 after a stag weekend. I don't think too much changes. 

[Wonderwall]

The behaviour mentioned in the news article sounds very "rugby boys behaviour old chap" which our great land appears to turn a blind eye too, where as the " football neds" get banning orders for less offensive acts.

The behaviour mentioned is beyond the acceptable by the length of Breydon, Disgusting behaviour on the broads is very rare in my experiences. I think it must be remembered it is  primarily a place for people to have their hard earned holidays, if you are lucky enough to spend months at a time there it's a fact you will " bump " into people who are letting their hair down. 

Apart from oneselves, nobody is perfect 

[Gracie]

"Apart from oneselves, nobody is perfect".............but as I keep telling im indoors, Neil, I'm as near as you're gonna get, for some strange reason he doesn't agree

Seriously though, spot on post

Grace

[Poppy]

11 hours ago, JennyMorgan said:

Trench coats, Gracie, now you're talking! 

Especially rubber ones

[MauriceMynah]

Ooooooooohh Gracie in a rubber trench coat... mmmmmmm!

Now look what you've gone and done Poppy !

[Timbo]

As my Grandad would say 'only perfect ' Grace. 'Only' perfect!

Sent from the Norfolk Broads Network mobile app

[JennyMorgan]

8 hours ago, Wonderwall said:

The behaviour mentioned in the news article sounds very "rugby boys behaviour old chap" which our great land appears to turn a blind eye too, where as the " football neds" get banning orders for less offensive acts.

The behaviour mentioned is beyond the acceptable by the length of Breydon, Disgusting behaviour on the broads is very rare in my experiences. I think it must be remembered it is  primarily a place for people to have their hard earned holidays, if you are lucky enough to spend months at a time there it's a fact you will " bump " into people who are letting their hair down. 

Apart from oneselves, nobody is perfect 

I can assure you that offensive rugby types locally have been hoofed out of their sailing clubs for lesser crimes! Pinching the bums of amply built waitresses is rightly frowned upon. Indeed several rugby shirt wearing oiks have had to endure justified prosecution. Neds with dosh to splash even go sailing, arghhh!

[JennyMorgan]

Both the Sun and the Times have picked up on this story:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/outrage-as-stag-party-louts-get-naked-on-norfolk-broads-v3fhbcrds

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3997431/boozy-stag-party-lads-stripped-waxed-and-peed-on-a-groom-in-front-of-families-at-holiday-hotspot/

In both cases the reporting is poor but whilst Sun customers might be attracted to the new Falaraki or however it's spelt I rather suspect that Times readers will see it as confirmation of what they have long believed. Perhaps something of an own goal by some within the industry.

[smellyloo]

I long for the days when people used to mind their own business, yes they might have uttered oaths under their breath, but mainly were content to live and let live.

Today we have armies of curtain twitching, key board bashing, busy bodies, cameras to hand to record any event that offends their rather narrow expectations of acceptable behaviour.

Sadly I can only see this kind of arm chair policing increasing ..... just think of the tensions this might release in the future!!

[LondonRascal]

If you are a hire operator, you are stuck between a rock and a hard place on this.

You exist to make money from hiring boats and giving people holidays – nothing else. You’re not the police, the ‘nanny’ to oversee their behaviour and you can only go so far in advice, additional deposits being held in cash and warnings on hand over.

As a company you are fully aware that these groups will be cruising the rivers drinking cans of beer and stopping off at various pubs too.  The pubs know they will be gaining extra custom too. The shops know they will be selling more alcohol as well. Everyone down the line is on ‘the take’ but at the same time they all hope that things don’t get too out of hand.

Because the majority go without too much of a hitch the few that cause damage or anti-social behaviour can be ‘ignored’ the problem now is this particular case is it escalated both at the time with the party of people pushing things further and further, the Police and Broads Authority being involved, the report in the EDP and other papers now going national and while we sit here debating this, and people will have been shocked and disgusted by what had happened you know full well there is going to be another group of people thinking ‘good on you lads’ for going this far.  

The issue is we are talking about a major tourist destination, with a massive tourist economy and it comes back to the fact if you are hiring boats and you look at your bookings and over a year see that perhaps 20% of your hires have come from Stag and Hen parties on your boats – do you decide to stop taking the risk and no longer hire to these groups? That is the bottom line – money. It is why despite the risks , the poor press coverage and shock it will blow over and the grumbles will continue but if this is where income can be made I can’t see anything changing.

[Wildfuzz]

Well from a professional view point we meet and greet every SSC (same sex crew) that hires on the Northern Broads during the season, to my surprise when started there are often 20 plus boats out each Friday which could be described as Hen or Stag boats, compare this with the number of reported incidents which is negligible.

 

They are given pleasant, but stern words of advice prior to the hire by Paul and Amy and it is a very very small minority who do not heed the advice and cause problems, those that are reported for any antisocial behavior are dealt with either by way of the hire yards, or if proportionate by Broads Beat officers and or BA rangers. I check every incident every day and reports of ASB are few and far between. Unfortunately when it does occur it seems to make the headlines, compare the recent incident as reported with an average Friday or Saturday night on Prince of Wales road, I am sure there are far more incidents that do not make the press every weekend at that location, just not newsworthy. I realize that at some locations such behavior is more prevalent but on the whole people respect the Broads.