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If I could just mention the RSPCA which is a charity I support. 

They are split, the national RSPCA is different to the local branches. The local branches are self funding and receive no help from headquarters. I popped into the local charity shop in Stalham and left them a pocketful of loose change I had accumulated. It will all be spent locally. 

I would respectfully suggest that if you want to donate to the RSPCA, do it to the local Branch eg East Norfolk, rather than the national  :default_biggrin:

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10 hours ago, Poppy said:

If you are genuinely angry because the RNLI have been spending a small proportion of their large income in preventing children from drowning because these were not in the UK, there s a massive void where your soul would normally be !

Many things in life have made me hard hearted, and no, I don't have a hole where my soul should be, and yes, I don't give a toss who doesn't like or disagree's with it. 

I hope that clarifies my thoughts on your ill thought out assumption?. 

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10 hours ago, Poppy said:

If you are genuinely angry because the RNLI have been spending a small proportion of their large income in preventing children from drowning because these were not in the UK, there s a massive void where your soul would normally be !

We are a small island compared to other countries on this planet and have enough problems of our own. We can't look out for everyone else outside of our borders.

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Whilst I can understand some of the angst caused by not being informed openly at time of donation to where your hard earned is being spent ,the information is available on their web for all to see.

The RNLI (IMHO) is a fantastic charitable body whom I have and still do support and if they feel that by directing some of their funding to educating people overseas and helping to prevent child deaths then I feel my donation is being well spent.

my only reservations nowadays are the increasingly large wages paid to senior staff in administration and at board level but I guess that is a sign of the times we live in , we no longer have the individually wealthy willing to step in and run these charities for free .

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If I’m correct the RNLI only covers the British Isles and the republic Ireland ... Why are they wasting donating money in other countries....?  Easy answer it’s run by brainless idiots....  The poor guys and gals who go out in all wind and weathers risking life death to save life’s need a more than a pat on the back by the fat cat chief executive who probably doesn’t know what the initials of The RNLI mean... 

Im still in disgust with the management of the RNLI how they treated Jersey Coxswain Andy Hibbs.. 

They ended up in the end reinstated him ... Then after all Andy and his crew left to form there own lifeboat (JLA) Jersey lifeboat association... what I am now a big supporter of... There life boat Sir Max Aitken 3rd a Tyne class boat has a broads connection as it was sold to the JLA from Goodchilds then sailed to Jersey... 

All lifeboat crews RNLI or independent ones do an amazing job.. I take my hat off to them...

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We all agree that lifeboat crews are a special breed of men and women who earn our respect every time they go out, their bravery is legend.

But how on earth can saving children from drowning anywhere in the world be a waste of money?

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2 hours ago, Ray said:

We all agree that lifeboat crews are a special breed of men and women who earn our respect every time they go out, their bravery is legend.

But how on earth can saving children from drowning anywhere in the world be a waste of money?

I do understand what you're saying Ray, but there comes a time when we have to make tough decisions where limited funds are concerned. Yes it's nice to help save ANY life, not just children's, All lives are sacred, be they 8 hours or 80 years, but we have to ask the question, what about that money being used to save lives in This country, lives of our ex servicemen left to their own defences after serving OUR country, lives of the mentally ill who take their lives through torment etc?. We cannot afford to keep treating the worlds ills, when we refuse to treat the ills of our own. 

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Please every one still donate when ever possible.The RNLI fills a special role in saving thousands of lives.Yes they do help other countries regarding life saving. Surely that's a good thing.Regarding some in management that's another matter,and needs addressing. Please, Please ,dont throw the baby out with the bath water.For my part and  others are collecting this weekend 0n the Woolwich ferry for the RNLI.

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12 hours ago, KaptinKev said:

We are a small island compared to other countries on this planet and have enough problems of our own. We can't look out for everyone else outside of our borders.

Are you aware that the RNLI operates a number of stations (46 ! ) in The Irish Republic ?  Should they do so  - it's after all,  'outside of our borders' ?

https://www.irishlifeboats.com/

Speed Triple, you may care to respond as well.

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I see many things in this thread which I agree with and many I don't.

Yes, the lifeboats are good causes and yes teaching children abroad to swim is another good cause... but it's a different good cause. If I donate to one good cause, I'd be a little miffed to find my money used for a different cause how ever deserving it may be.

In that sense Poppy, I agree with Speedtriple in that your post was a little ill thought out. 

Also, If I donate to a charity, but find that the charity is supporting a political agenda with which I disagree, I may well stop supporting that charity, but that would be MY decision, My choice. For a third party to question this would be inappropriate in my far from humble opinion.

On the matter of "Pay scales" for directors, Yes! that one is a thorny issue. I'm uncomfortable with the term "fat cats" as I feel that charitable donations should be spent in an as efficient way as possible. If that needs top men in top jobs then so be it. Bite the bullet and pay the bill!. For those same people to involve themselves in the day to day running of the organisation, NO! That needs people who know and live with the ethos of the front line soldiers.

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Well put post MM, I think we all broadly agree about the good work and the need for better resources at home.

The charity sector should be where we get to choose where are personal donations go exactly... hence the disquiet about charities extending their brief beyond what people believe they are supporting.

Personally I will continue to support the RNLI because I'm happy about the 2% overseas spending.

Transparency is the key

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32 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

In that sense Poppy, I agree with Speedtriple in that your post was a little ill thought out. 

 

The RNLI, in saving lives in international waters, are displaying some of the values and standards that we want the international community to see us British as having. The same values and standards that are being destroyed currently before our very eyes. Let's show them we mean to uphold what is good, moral and right.

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23 hours ago, Poppy said:

If you are genuinely angry because the RNLI have been spending a small proportion of their large income in preventing children from drowning because these were not in the UK, there s a massive void where your soul would normally be !

This is the post I disagree with Poppy. as I said above...

51 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

Yes, the lifeboats are good causes and yes teaching children abroad to swim is another good cause... but it's a different good cause. If I donate to one good cause, I'd be a little miffed to find my money used for a different cause how ever deserving it may be.

Generally I agree with your sentiments though I'm not sure about...

20 minutes ago, Poppy said:

The same values and standards that are being destroyed currently before our very eyes.

as I'm not sure what you mean by it.

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12 hours ago, CambridgeCabby said:

I guess that is a sign of the times we live in , we no longer have the individually wealthy willing to step in and run these charities for free .

I think that valid comment goes a long way to explain the present charities "industry" and not just in the case of the RNLI.

I am an old codger who grew up in the days when charity work was entirely voluntary and no-one would have thought of actually getting paid for it! There were some great men and women in Norfolk who gave enormously of their time (and money) to look after local and national charities. I can think off-hand of Ian Mackintosh, Humphrey Boardman, Timothy Colman and of course, Lady Mayhew. I am sure you can think of others. Martin Broom for instance.

There was hardly a local charity or association that didn't have Ian as either its president or chairman and his secretary at Rountree Mackintosh, Pamela Oakes, ended up as the honorary secretary for nearly all of them!

The days of "Noblesse oblige" and "To the manor born" are long gone, it seems.

 

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5 minutes ago, MauriceMynah said:

This is the post I disagree with Poppy. as I said above...

Generally I agree with your sentiments though I'm not sure about...

as I'm not sure what you mean by it.

Really ?

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Errm, yes, really!

However on most of this discussion I think we agree with the important issues but are not eye to eye on the finer points. Certainly nothing to fall out about!

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On 16/09/2019 at 09:25, Poppy said:

If you are genuinely angry because the RNLI have been spending a small proportion of their large income in preventing children from drowning because these were not in the UK, there s a massive void where your soul would normally be !

It's always amazing how compassion is inversely proportional to distance. Im very proud that my contributions might have an impact in saving lives, why would I be upset if that was foreign lives that were being saved.

 

You have to admit that if you unhappy with this money being spent, you are also happy that people die who could have been saved.

Not a good look.

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I suppose it's a bit like donating to the RSPB. If they spent the money trying to save the beleaguered little house sparrow, or skylark I would be happy to do so. But when I find my money is being spent lobbying politicians, who earn enough already or watching dolphins in Scotland I think no. 

Scottish dolphins are no doubt a good cause, but not the concern of the Royal Society for the Protection of Birds. The clue is in the name. 

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On ‎17‎/‎09‎/‎2019 at 08:13, Poppy said:

Are you aware that the RNLI operates a number of stations (46 ! ) in The Irish Republic ?  Should they do so  - it's after all,  'outside of our borders' ?

https://www.irishlifeboats.com/

Speed Triple, you may care to respond as well.

Ireland was within our boarders when the RNLI was created, the Irish govenment make up the difference between the moneys raised for the RNLI in the UK, that in Ireland and the expenses in running their lifeboat stations

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It will NEVER sit well with me when most of the people doing the actual dangerous work are doing it for little to nothing. 

Volunteer Crews (who do a sterling job) risk their lives for free while the Chief Exec takes home his luxury salary with all his allowances.  Overpaid much or what.....I cant and wont accept its a necessity.  

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The RNLI says it turned over £163 million in 2018.  What is an appropriate salary for the chief exec?

If I remember rightly the BA turns over £6m and the CEO gets about £100k. 

The RNLI chief exec was himself a volunteer and had a senior position at a bank

I think sometimes this forum comes across as being populated by naive people who cannot accept how the world works.

A budget in the 9 figures requires a command of finance over most other considerations. I’d do the job for £30k but they’d be idiots to hire me.  

 

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43 minutes ago, twowrights said:

Spurn lifeboat crew are  on-site full time and are the only  full-time paid RNLI crew in the UK, I wonder what sort of wage they are paid.

Gravesend and from memory, at least one other Thames based station are full time manned stations.

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At one time I seriously considered volunteering for Thames station. Unfortunately I was just over the age limit. There they have a full time  skipper, as far as I know the rest unpaid volunteers. One of our members (Bexleyheath).Is unpaid  volunteer.

I also believe large organisations need paid managers, to run such organisations. They also need to be accountable. Thus can be hired and fired.There is no doubt, that mistakes happen.Does this only happen within the RNLI of course not.Remember not a penny comes from Government  it comes entirely from the penny.Believe on Saturday collecting on the ferry many will drop pounds,5,10,and twenties in the bucket. That money needs to be spent  wisely. I think in general it is.Is there room for improvement of course. As I said dont throw the baby out with the bath water.

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7 hours ago, batrabill said:

If I remember rightly the BA turns over £6m and the CEO gets about £100k. 

 

Interesting point. Did the River Commissioners get paid, back in the day? They were drawn from local businessmen and professionals and may have drawn a director's fee (usually a pittance) but not a salary as such.

7 hours ago, batrabill said:

I think sometimes this forum comes across as being populated by naive people who cannot accept how the world works.

Oh dear. In defence of my naivety, my previous post mentioned people who were themselves captains of industry, who gave of their time and experience to charity at no charge. I mentioned Ian Mackintosh. Do you remember Mackintosh's "Rolo" or "Toffolux"? A big employer in Norwich for several generations and certainly capable of handling a turnover in the millions. Or Timothy Colman, the Lord Lieutenant of Norfolk. Surely you have heard of Colman's Mustard?

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