Fenders Up Or Down When Underway

[SPEEDTRIPLE]

I remember about 4 1/2 years back, we had a boat from Maffetts which had a GPS speedo on it. We were cruising along and i noticed the "wake" from the fenders, as someone had lowered them, resulted in them dragging through the water. Kestrel was a 42ft Alpha, and when i put them on the side decks, our speed went up by .5 mph. Or, if we dropped the revs to maintain 4 mph, we would be making quite a saving on fuel.

[grendel]

the main thing about cheesing the ropes is that for any of the crew moving in that area they are safer as there is less of a trip hazard, on the lads week we eventually managed to get the mooring lines cheesed down after we had got all the kinks out of them

[Lastdraft]

Have to disagree. The reason for cheesing down a rope is purely aesthetic. To avoid a trip hazard ropes should be coiled and hung from a guardrail or bulkhead. Few of us have boats with a deck area big enough to hide a trip hazard.  

[LondonRascal]

Fenders, to me are there for one reason and one reason only - to protect the hull of the boat when alongside.  Therefore when you are not alongside a mooring there is no need to use them. 

If a boat is going to collide with you when underway you will be very lucky if one of your fenders (or theirs) happens to be in just the right place to protect the boat at the point of collision.  Even if they were in just the right place, if both craft were on a slow river and had a closing speed of close on 8 MPH not much a fender will do to help cushion anything.

Others will no doubt have their own opinion on this, but in all the time I have been cruising the rivers I have never been hit by a boat while both they and I were underway.

This leaves the times you are moored. Lets take for an example of St. Benet's Abbey.  Now this is a good area because despite being a straight stretch of moorings, on a wide river, boats will often keep too far over to their Starboard side having passed the ruins and 'posted shallows' thus sometimes be no more than a metre away from you when they pass. Again, if you were hit by a passing boat here (and they were doing the speed limit) what would a fender be reasonably expected to protect when your hull is 'side swiped' at 5 MPH?

The most common causes of damage seem to be when a boat comes into a mooring (either to their own hull or someone else who is already moored) and because there are so many scruffs and gouges out of boats hulls, fenders don't always 'come to the rescue' even there.  So if you are going to get a bang, hit a mooring too hard or accidentally hit another boat unless these happen to be a light nudge, the fender's are not going to be of too much help - or Sod's Law will appear and the fender will end up being in the wrong place.

Some boats are simply too small to put the fenders anywhere but over the side - they either have side decks so narrow the fenders roll right off, or they have no reasonable area for several fenders to be stowed - Trixie is one such boat. At 24' long and 9' 6" wide she has precious little space as it is let alone for her fenders so they stay over the side at all times.  Independence on the other hand only has fenders down when she is alongside (or on the short hop around to the fuel pump) - otherwise they are stowed but then she has the space.  Broad Ambition has lovely wide side decks, so her fenders not only can be taken up but also allow for you to walk around the boat when they are up.  Despite this being something easy to do, and despite our own etiquette of so doing it does not stop some Skippers leaving a blue one down. 

[Baitrunner]

I think you have contradicted yourself Robin. 

 

[Thiswan]

22 minutes ago, LondonRascal said:

Fenders, to me are there for one reason and one reason only - to protect the hull of the boat when alongside.  Therefore when you are not alongside a mooring there is no need to use them. 

If a boat is going to collide with you when underway you will be very lucky if one of your fenders (or theirs) happens to be in just the right place to protect the boat at the point of collision.  Even if they were in just the right place, if both craft were on a slow river and had a closing speed of close on 8 MPH not much a fender will do to help cushion anything.

Others will no doubt have their own opinion on this, but in all the time I have been cruising the rivers I have never been hit by a boat while both they and I were underway.

This leaves the times you are moored. Lets take for an example of St. Benet's Abbey.  Now this is a good area because despite being a straight stretch of moorings, on a wide river, boats will often keep too far over to their Starboard side having passed the ruins and 'posted shallows' thus sometimes be no more than a metre away from you when they pass. Again, if you were hit by a passing boat here (and they were doing the speed limit) what would a fender be reasonably expected to protect when your hull is 'side swiped' at 5 MPH?

The most common causes of damage seem to be when a boat comes into a mooring (either to their own hull or someone else who is already moored) and because there are so many scruffs and gouges out of boats hulls, fenders don't always 'come to the rescue' even there.  So if you are going to get a bang, hit a mooring too hard or accidentally hit another boat unless these happen to be a light nudge, the fender's are not going to be of too much help - or Sod's Law will appear and the fender will end up being in the wrong place.

Some boats are simply too small to put the fenders anywhere but over the side - they either have side decks so narrow the fenders roll right off, or they have no reasonable area for several fenders to be stowed - Trixie is one such boat. At 24' long and 9' 6" wide she has precious little space as it is let alone for her fenders so they stay over the side at all times.  Independence on the other hand only has fenders down when she is alongside (or on the short hop around to the fuel pump) - otherwise they are stowed but then she has the space.  Broad Ambition has lovely wide side decks, so her fenders not only can be taken up but also allow for you to walk around the boat when they are up.  Despite this being something easy to do, and despite our own etiquette of so doing it does not stop some Skippers leaving a blue one down. 

A short Video of me fender moveing at Reedham with a fast tide would be "You Tube" classic. Now if only I could train the dog!

[marshman]

"Cheesing" ropes is too poncy for me - also doing that can all too easily put in unnecessary kinks. I went them ready to use when I want them, and not to spend time coiling them properly!!

Fenders - on the Broads leave them down but I do agree on sailing boats they can look a bit naff down. Trouble is when sailing they just roll in when heeled and when mooring, I have enough to do without playing with bits of string!

Now Albion has a decent system - 3/4" galvanised steel binn iron all round!!!!

[Ray]

That clip of Broad Ambition at sea! She looks fantastic!

Just an observation... fenders are down all the time with us! Once we have cast off I want my crew off deck asap so I can relax. Very hard to replace good crew, especially when you've been married to them for 40 years! 

[Vaughan]

52 minutes ago, marshman said:

Now Albion has a decent system - 3/4" galvanised steel binn iron all round!!!!

Definitely. You can't argue with that, and many have tried!

When stowing rope ready for use, this all depends on the "lay" of the rope. Almost all rope on the Broads is three strand, "left hand laid". So when you are coiling it ready for use, you always coil it into your left hand, and it will not kink. you then lay the coil on the deck, or hook it up, ready for use.

"cheesing down" is not just decorative. It is done in order to stow a rope on deck which is not going to be used very often. For instance, the Albion's forestay. In her case, it is coiled and hooked onto the cheek of one of the forestay blocks but It could just as well be cheesed down on deck. BA does the same thing for the mud weight rope, which is not going to be used all that often.

The trick with cheesing down, is that you have to do it in the right direction, with the "lay" of the rope, or else you end up with a bird's nest!

[grendel]

4 hours ago, Lastdraft said:

Have to disagree. The reason for cheesing down a rope is purely aesthetic. To avoid a trip hazard ropes should be coiled and hung from a guardrail or bulkhead. Few of us have boats with a deck area big enough to hide a trip hazard.  

some boats dont have a convenient guard rail or bulkhead handy, so flat on the deck is better than loops sticking up for the unwary foot.

[hazelgirl]

I have to admit Griff has conditioned us into cheesing ropes and lifting fenders, it is only because we are able and my deck hand (Mark) doesn't mind doing it lol

[CambridgeCabby]

I’m often solo cruising so is impractical for me to be “fenders up”

[Wyndham]

Fenders up and Cheesing do look good, no doubt.

For me though, almost without exception, I don't do "unnecessary"

The idea of lifting  fenders on deck when the next thing I'm gonna do with them is lower them in my mind is unnecessary.

I understand why people do it though.

Mrs W lowers the kitchen blind before bed and first thing in the morning raises it, maybe it's a OCD thing.

[Broads01]

Always down for me, especially as I'm often solo. If you have a lovely looking woodie like Broad Ambition I can see the advantage of lifting them to look your best, so to speak but it does seem a bit of unnecessary faff for the rest of us. 

I'm surprised to read a few comments about fenders trailing in the water and the disadvantages of such. Am I right in thinking that if a fender is touching the water it's adjusted too low? 

On 25/01/2019 at 20:19, Vaughan said:

When stowing rope ready for use, this all depends on the "lay" of the rope. Almost all rope on the Broads is three strand, "left hand laid". So when you are coiling it ready for use, you always coil it into your left hand, and it will not kink. you then lay the coil on the deck, or hook it up, ready for use.

Great tip Vaughan and one I've never heard before. As I'm right-handed it's natural for me to coil in my left hand anyway. However now I can do so knowing I'm doing it right 😊

[vanessan]

1 hour ago, Broads01 said:

Am I right in thinking that if a fender is touching the water it's adjusted too low? 

It’s most probably a case of fenders being adjusted on a mooring to cope with a high tide and not being readjusted. 

[Maxwellian]

On 25/01/2019 at 17:57, LondonRascal said:

Fenders, to me are there for one reason and one reason only - to protect the hull of the boat when alongside.  Therefore when you are not alongside a mooring there is no need to use them. 

If a boat is going to collide with you when underway you will be very lucky if one of your fenders (or theirs) happens to be in just the right place to protect the boat at the point of collision.  Even if they were in just the right place, if both craft were on a slow river and had a closing speed of close on 8 MPH not much a fender will do to help cushion anything.

Others will no doubt have their own opinion on this, but in all the time I have been cruising the rivers I have never been hit by a boat while both they and I were underway.

This leaves the times you are moored. Lets take for an example of St. Benet's Abbey.  Now this is a good area because despite being a straight stretch of moorings, on a wide river, boats will often keep too far over to their Starboard side having passed the ruins and 'posted shallows' thus sometimes be no more than a metre away from you when they pass. Again, if you were hit by a passing boat here (and they were doing the speed limit) what would a fender be reasonably expected to protect when your hull is 'side swiped' at 5 MPH?

The most common causes of damage seem to be when a boat comes into a mooring (either to their own hull or someone else who is already moored) and because there are so many scruffs and gouges out of boats hulls, fenders don't always 'come to the rescue' even there.  So if you are going to get a bang, hit a mooring too hard or accidentally hit another boat unless these happen to be a light nudge, the fender's are not going to be of too much help - or Sod's Law will appear and the fender will end up being in the wrong place.

Some boats are simply too small to put the fenders anywhere but over the side - they either have side decks so narrow the fenders roll right off, or they have no reasonable area for several fenders to be stowed - Trixie is one such boat. At 24' long and 9' 6" wide she has precious little space as it is let alone for her fenders so they stay over the side at all times.  Independence on the other hand only has fenders down when she is alongside (or on the short hop around to the fuel pump) - otherwise they are stowed but then she has the space.  Broad Ambition has lovely wide side decks, so her fenders not only can be taken up but also allow for you to walk around the boat when they are up.  Despite this being something easy to do, and despite our own etiquette of so doing it does not stop some Skippers leaving a blue one down. 

I must be getting ill... yet again I find myself agreeing with Robin... now, where are those tablets!

[Malanka]

I have had a stern line round the prop, it dropped off when mooring after being casually tossed there when we departed the previous mooring. Cheesed every time for us now.

Tripple braided lines don’t like being just left they get very kinked too. 

 

M

[JanetAnne]

On 25/01/2019 at 16:45, grendel said:

...cheesing the ropes...

Never knew it had an official name. Every day is a learning day!

On 25/01/2019 at 19:14, marshman said:

 

Now Albion has a decent system - 3/4" galvanised steel binn iron all round!!!!

That's why we need fenders! 

A friend once told me that if we were to replace the air bags on modern cars with a carving knife pointing towards the driver, speeding, careless driving and accidents would be all but eliminated!

Perhaps we should replace the fenders with five pound notes attached to the rubbing strakes and, at the end of the week, we only get to take the whole ones home again 

[Smoggy]

On 25/01/2019 at 20:19, Vaughan said:

Almost all rope on the Broads is three strand, "left hand laid".

Not mine, double braid dockline for me, always run back to the cockpit and hung ready for use without having to go along the decks at all and you have more control if you can step off with both fore and aft lines, usually tethered behind elastic tiebacks and always tied off in the cockpit when at sea.

I thought there were no such things as ropes on boats, just lines/sheets/halyards/cables/warps.

[vanessan]

1 hour ago, Smoggy said:

I thought there were no such things as ropes on boats, just lines/sheets/halyards/cables/warps.

Depends how posh you are I think. 

[Seagypsy]

1 hour ago, Smoggy said:

Not mine, double braid dockline for me, always run back to the cockpit and hung ready for use without having to go along the decks at all and you have more control if you can step off with both fore and aft lines, usually tethered behind elastic tiebacks and always tied off in the cockpit when at sea.

I thought there were no such things as ropes on boats, just lines/sheets/halyards/cables/warps.

You get ropes on boats because the majority of boaters don't know what lines/halyards etc are.

[Smoggy]

18 minutes ago, Seagypsy said:

You get ropes on boats because the majority of boaters don't know what lines/halyards etc are.

I do know though, they are daft names for ropes.....

[Seagypsy]

2 minutes ago, Smoggy said:

I do know though, they are daft names for ropes.....

Not directed at you. I'm ex M.N. and you obviously know what they are

[grendel]

I do know sheets go on beds....

 

[Smoggy]

1 minute ago, Seagypsy said:

Not directed at you. I'm ex M.N. and you obviously know what they are

No worries I wasn't taking personally in any way, and to be fair I would be guessing if I tried to name which was which.